Hey I have been MIA for quite a long time but had to jump in on this discussion! I moved from DC to Satellite Beach, FL 6 months ago... I am saying that because living in DC for so long I forgot the open-minded "ness" of "no child by choice" does not really transfer down south. It is obnoxious to judge other people's life decisions. No one knows your childhood or past life experiences or even health or mental abilities to raise a child? Do you really want to pressure someone who might not even be able to fully handle a child to have a child because it is the norm? I mentioned this before in a post long ago but also nothing is worse to a child than knowing or just feeling they are not fully wanted. People look at me & judge my oceanfront apt... Well if you and your husband had children you could never afford to live there and guess what they are probably right.... but guess what also it was a choice!!! Too funny when people ask if I have children I say no but my friend actually just cut them off and says no and I never wanted them I need to start saying that because the questions just don't stop. So high five to the other women out there who are persecuted for your decision to live child-free... For WHATEVER reason that may be!

Husbandpillow wrote:

My issue is that I find myself judging people who to decide to *have* kids. I do not understand the motivation to be sleep deprived for years on end, willingly. It quite literally boggles my mind. I'm not saying that my point of view is the correct point of view, I know I'm being judgemental, I'm just on the totally opposite end of the spectrum of judgement lol. I just can't understand/empathize with voluntary torture!  

I think it's a standard belief that anyone who willingly has kids is nuts lol. I give props to all the women who choose not to, and are out there in the workplace excelling at their careers and climbing up the corporate ladder and opening up doors for all us working gals.

By the way I love this conversation so much! And this forum! Thank you to those who run this site, it is an awesome place to connect!
 

I was traveling today with a new colleague that I do not know very well. We were discussing another upcoming work trip and she was saying how difficult travel is for work as she has two young kids. I just made some validating reply like, "I'm sure it's difficult" (she knows I don't have kids) and she then proceeded to ask me if I ever plan to have kids (no) and then said "I guess if I was selfish with my time and freedom and stuck in your pace of life, I wouldn't want to either." Excuse me?!?! This is exactly why there is a divide between women with children and women without.

DestinationAwesometown wrote:

I was traveling today with a new colleague that I do not know very well. We were discussing another upcoming work trip and she was saying how difficult travel is for work as she has two young kids. I just made some validating reply like, "I'm sure it's difficult" (she knows I don't have kids) and she then proceeded to ask me if I ever plan to have kids (no) and then said "I guess if I was selfish with my time and freedom and stuck in your pace of life, I wouldn't want to either." Excuse me?!?! This is exactly why there is a divide between women with children and women without.

 
Are you writing this from jail? I would be, because I would have dismembered her if she said that to me!!

DestinationAwesometown wrote:

I was traveling today with a new colleague that I do not know very well. We were discussing another upcoming work trip and she was saying how difficult travel is for work as she has two young kids. I just made some validating reply like, "I'm sure it's difficult" (she knows I don't have kids) and she then proceeded to ask me if I ever plan to have kids (no) and then said "I guess if I was selfish with my time and freedom and stuck in your pace of life, I wouldn't want to either." Excuse me?!?! This is exactly why there is a divide between women with children and women without.

 
Wow! Just wow...how someone would ever have the audacity to speak to a person that way is beyond my comprehension. That's disgusting.

MyMindsTellingMeNo wrote:

OMG, enough!!!  I am so sick of the "must be nice" and "you'll never know" comments.  YOU chose to be a parent...it's not just something the universe bestowed upon you.  I know plenty of resentful mothers, most of them being some of the most impulsive/attention seeking people I know who found themselves with two rugrats by 30.  You know what, the fact that YOU couldn't chill for a little while after rushing from life event (college) to life event (marriage) to life event (babies) is on YOU.  Get off me.  I'm over here being content with life.  Loving marriage, loving my job and love being selfish!

This thread, coupled with a comment I got from a "friend" this weekend about my spa day, really has me peeved. 

 
BOOM. Amen sister!! 💗💗💗

It is a bit one sided because only women with kids have lived both sides. You can think you know what it's like to have kids before you have them, but you can't really know. That said, you don't have to lose all your empathy when you have kids. Everyone has there own stressors in life and stuff to deal with. It's important for both people to be understanding of the other's situations if you want to remain friends.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/amy-westervelt/having-it-all-kinda-sucks_b_9237772.html? I think this article is pretty good. 

DestinationAwesometown wrote:

My choice to not have kids is complicated, there is not "one" reason but many that have led me to this choice. It's a very personal decision and I don't share it with just anyone. And it's makes me wonder why wwk (women with kids) have no problem questioning me. As a woman without kids (wwook), I have never questioned why wwk have made the choice to have kids. Ever, even when I've been dying to say what the fuck are you doing?! I think what I hate most about wwk vs wwok is the "I'm better/more woman than you" mentality. Just because you popped out six kids and named them after Days of Our Lives characters does not give you a special award that is shinier or bigger than any of my awards.

Yes to all of this. Especially the shortcut- wwook.  I'm going to call myself a wooki for now on!
 

"Named them after Days of our Lives characters", bahahahahaha!!!!! 

I agree! And I also agree that a lot of these feelings are magnified on the receivers end. But that doesn't make it any less true.

Of course none of us *should* be judging anyone's life choices, but how often does that actually happen. Most people are not self-aware enough to think before they speak... Culturally it is acceptable for the babymommas to judge us childlessladies because we are not the "norm". It would be insane if I walked around tell people they have no idea what they are missing out on by not being Childers or telling a pregnant woman that she will change her mind about wanting that baby one day. (I have been told multiple times that I will "change my mind when the time is right")... I'm a pretty confident and self aware woman in my thirties, and long entire I met my husband I knew I didn't want to be a mom. I doubt that will ever change. But god forbid I say to a babymomma that she will probably change her mind in a few years and she'll wish she hadn't had her baby!

Ahhhh! Sorry ladies. Rant over!

Siriusnj wrote:

Husbandpillow wrote:

I also think part of the problem is now women are expected to do and be everything. Full time employee, full time mom, full time running the household. The economic climate practically demands double income households now, yet the role of the male/expectations of them in society have essentially stayed exactly the same as the 50's more or less. Women are now (and have been for the past 25 or so years) expected to bring home the bacon, fry it up, serve it, clean it up, do the dishes, and then do everything else. I think the millennial generation will finally change this dynamic, but I can't believe how long it has survived. It's a relic of a time that doesn't exist anymore. This isn't why I choose not to have children, but it still annoys the sh*t out of me when I witness it's effects on women.  

I completely disagree, How many men do you see taking kids to activities? How many men do you see actively involved in cooking and housework vs the 50s? Men are now expected to be much more actively involved then before.

 
I think that some men are doing more.  My dad was super involved with me and my brother, but so many cousins and friends didn't grow up with that being the case. I see your point and I agree that a lot of men are more involved than previous generations, but society doesn't expect or demand it from them, as it does with women. Men don't get judged the way women do when it comes to raising the kids (by society as a whole) I witness both sides of this and I see way more men uninvolved, than involved but that's just what I've observed in my life. I think there is a shift happening with expectation of men, but slowly. Anyway I kinda agree with both of your statements.

We have dogs - that is the judgement I get that infuriates me: "it's just a dog, it's not the same as a baby. You don't know that kind of love." To which I promptly reply, "You can kindly fuck off now." Lol. I'll never understand why some people are afraid of other people "coloring outside the lines". I don't get it. Like, everybody...just do you. ✌🏼️❤️🐶
 

We get this same judgement as well!  My husband and I have yet to come to a firm decision on wanting children or not but most of our friends and family have kids already and I feel constantly judged. Especially when it comes to our dog! It infuriates me and often makes me feel like an outsider who isn't good enough to be considered a real person. What everyone on here is saying is how I've felt for years. There's such pressure and guilt and judgement associated with not wanting to have children. I always say I want to want to have kids, but I just don't. And I feel like I have no one to talk to about that who really gets it!  It sounds like you guys do though ❤️

I don't have kids either but I teach the little kid's Sunday School at my church.  Every Sunday I want to walk up to the parents and say, "What the hell possessed you to want to procreate?"  One hour a week is more than enough reminder to me that I made the right decision!  LOL!

meepmeep wrote:

Parents with one child are also judged.i have one child and we do not plan on having any more.  I accept that people judge me. Some people think it is selfish for not wanting to give my son a sibling. I'm okay with being selfish.

 
I feel the same way.  We have only one child and I get judged all the time on why we won't have more.  It's not anyone's business whether a person chooses to have kids or how many kids.  We are happy as a family of three but people make it seem we are not complete.